Confused about cinnamon

It wouldn’t short term, but I guess the problem is the time it takes to break down the Courmarin for the liver at larger doses than the TDI, makes it accumalate. If you stick to the TDI, it shouldn’t be a problem short term or long term… but it might put a little extra strain on your liver long term.

As you saw in some of the other examples above, people can “safely” consume 6 grams a day over 6 weeks, if they take a weeks break afterwards, giving the liver times to break it down and recover. But they also mention that you could take it at that amount 5 days a week and 2 days rest.

Try and see how many grams of cassia you need to get the taste you want, if it is low enough, you don’t need to worry at all, but I personally recommend switching to Ceylon when you get the chance if you plan to use it everyday regardless.

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Depends what a few shakes are. @axcho for example uses 4.3 grams of Saigon cinnamon in Schmoylent Cinnamon. The amount seem in line with what people use to flavor Soylent. @marvin737 did some math on the limits that looks good to me.

0.00113kg is 1.13 grams. So it would seem Schmoylent cinnamon has 4 times the TDI (well, potentially more - saigon cinnamon vs cassia?)

1.13 grams is pretty small. http://www.aqua-calc.com/calculate/food-volume-to-weight calculates 1 teaspoon as 2.6 grams. So we’re talking 1/2 teaspoon.

In my opinion, Ceylon is a no brainer if you’re using cinnamon to flavor Soylent.

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Assuming these numbers are correct, it seems that if you have a bottle of cassia cinnamon to use up, it will be safe if you use a half teaspoon or less, per day. It would be best if you don’t use it every day, because a day off will give your liver an extra day to catch up with cleaning the coumarin out of your blood.

If you need a full teaspoon to get your flavoring effect, it might be wiser to use it every other day.

Either way, when you finish the bottle… get ceylon.

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I’m considering switching to Ceylon for my next round of recipes, but the reason I’ve been using Saigon is because Tim Ferris recommends it over other cinnamon varieties for its effect on blood sugar. :stuck_out_tongue: My understanding was that coumarin was (in addition to being toxic at too-high doses) also the agent responsible for these beneficial effects, but I may be mistaken. My research since then has been focused on “normal” nutrition, I guess, rather than extra modifying factors.

Can anyone speak to the blood sugar regulating effects of Ceylon versus Saigon cinnamon?

We seem to be at the stage where we’re still figuring out what components of cinnamon are the mechanisms of its various actions. We’ve just recently finished establishing the the effects are genuine. Most published studies I find are clarifying the effects of cinnamon on different conditions, but not attempting to isolate the active compounds or exact mechanism. In fact, most studies don’t seem to specify the kind of cinnamon they used!

This PubMed article on the potential benefits of cinnamon in treatment diabetes mentions that Cassia is the type most often used in the research. However, the second page of the article notes the various suspected mechanisms; they mention a variety of suspects, but coumarin is not among them:

The mechanism by which cinnamon increases GLP-1 is unknown, but its effects may be similar to the GLP-1 analogues exenatide and liraglutide, or the dipetidyl-peptidase 4 (DPP4) inhibitors sitagliptin, saxagliptin, and linagliptin.

Cinnamon may also be involved in the activation of peroxisome proliferator–activated receptors (PPAR)-γ and PPAR-α.[3,13,14] Thiazolidinediones, including pioglitazone and rosiglitazone, target PPAR-γ and promote insulin sensitivity. The fibrate class of anti-hyperlipidemics target PPAR-α, which lowers plasma triglycerides and elevates plasma high-density lipoprotein cholesterol.

Finally, rodent models suggest that cinnamon may inhibit hepatic 3-hydroxy- 3-methyl-glutaryl CoA reductase activity.[15–17] This mechanism parallels that of the popular statin drug class.

I don’t even see mention of the family that includes coumarin. (For reference, coumarin, also called 1-benzopyran-2-one, is in the benzopyrone chemical class.)

So… the fact that Ceylon is low in coumarin is not a problem. However, it may also be low in whatever else is in Saigon and Cassia which have the beneficial effect. That remains to be seen. For now, the, most of the knowledge is about Cassia, specifically.

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How many pumpkin pies can I eat per day before my liver explodes, that’s all I wanna know.

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Thanks for the clarification, @MentalNomad. :slight_smile:

@Larry, somehow I don’t think cinnamon is the limiting factor in that scenario… :wink:

Cinnamon is bark, and undigestible. Delicious yeh, but undigestible. The tiny particles irritate your guts, perhaps exacerbate leaky gut. IMO, particles–almost don’t matter which–are just as much a problem for leaky gut as big bad gluten, and dairy, etc. Use cinnamon, IMO, as a flavor, in tiny amounts, and enjoy it, but don’t use it as a medicine. If you must use it as a medicine buy–and stop squawking about cost–the water-soluble cinnamon extract with harmful stuff removed. If you need cinnamon for blood sugar issues, you got a problem cinnamon won’t cure anyway. Cure the sugar issues by not ingesting anything which spikes your blood sugar, and be sure to burn your blood sugar after meals with activity, all day, evry day–not “excercise”, not frantic “workouts”, but activity. Forget cinnamon for sugar issues.

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I use this stuff its tasty and half the price of the walmart stuff:
http://www.amazon.com/Frontier-Organic-Powdered-Ceylon-Cinnamon/dp/B00416T8Q6/ref=pd_ys_sf_s_rp_a1_7_p?ie=UTF8&refRID=1TEFAT73F3G3FASTN301

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There is more to cinnamon than the indigestible fiber. Not much more but still more. Some studies have shown positive results in regard to cinnamon consumption and improved insulin response. No one here is saying cinnamon is a cure for insult resistance. They are saying it seems to help.

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I dunno, man. I was just called stupid for using cinnamon, and it really hurt. Things like that never used to bother me, you know?

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Here’s your answer to cinnamon/ insulin issues; http://cinnulin.com/

No affiliation with this product whatsoever.

eom

So, what, like three per day? I guess I should be cutting back…

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Oh god, I’ve been putting a lot of Saigon cinnamon (which looks like it has the most coumarin) in my Soylent every day for months.

Is there anything I go do to remove the built up coumarin from my body???

Just don’t use it for a some days… :stuck_out_tongue: Your liver will take care of the rest.

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Is there a Taco Bell nearby?

I recommend you start drafting a last will and testament immediately.

This is very interesting. Do you feel bad at all? Have you noticed any negative changes in your body? It is kind of hard to believe that cinnamon is poisonous when I hear stuff like you have been eating it every day for a month.

I told my roommate about this thread because he eats toast every morning for breakfast and he puts ground cassia cinnamon and butter on it. He has been doing this as long as we’ve been roommates with him (about 1.5 years) and he claims to not have any health problems at all.

Do some people just have a better tolerance or is cinnamon not quite as poisonous as we are being led to believe?

Yeah, I’ve actually had several weird medical issues that I’ve had to go to see several doctors for, and one trip to the ER. I doubt it is the cinnamon from the Soylent though, but who knows? I’m not a doctor.

Like tordenskjold said ask him to stop it immediately too. And if he develops any symptoms or falls ill tell him to visit a doctor and remind him to tell the doc about his consumption habits.