I know Rob mentioned playing with Nootropics but that he eventually removed them. Has anyone else played with them, and if so, what did you use? I’m guessing nobody is throwing modafinil into their soylent.
Rob talks a little about the ones he takes here: http://discourse.soylent.me/discourse/t/what-is-your-nootropic-stack/333/2
I’ve been spending quite a bit of time lately (like 40+ hours) reading about what’s out there, diving into studies etc. I’ve hence purchased about 20 promising substances for experimentation. At the moment I’m throwing them into a spreadsheet by how they work e.g. increase serotonin, MAO inhibitor, etc. Combining the wrong nootropics can be uncomfortable (stomach upset, headaches, priapism), dangerous (withdrawal, serotonin syndrome, allergic reaction), or even deadly (hypertensive emergency, drug interactions). The risks are small and are mostly related to long term use… but long term use is what most nootropic users do!
So far I’ve found a combo of arginine and citocholine, with pramiracetam on weekdays to be fairly effective (and very safe). I found hederagenin w/ caffeine to be extremely effective (and expensive) but as an MAOI I couldn’t safely take many of the other nootropics I wanted to try, and it interacts with tons of prescription meds too. It takes a couple weeks to undo what it does to your brain, so I’m still waiting on that so I can try some others.
Hederagenin is a tricky one. From what I can find, research is scant and mostly from a single Chinese source. It appears to mostly act as a powerful stimulant, not a genuine nootropic.
Piracetam (and other racetams) are certainly the staple of the nootropic world, and once you find your appropriate dosage and other supplements (choline in whatever your preferred form is) then it’s a solid place to be.
I intend to experiment with adrafinil and see if it proves more beneficial then my racetam stack.
Hederegenin works by increasing levels of dopamine, serotonin, and norepinephrine, which definitely qualifies it as a nootropic. Caffeine does the same thing, but caffeine also increases epinephrine (adrenaline); because of that, I can’t stand caffeine. I’m really sensitive to it since I never have it, but a little bit along with hederagenin seems to be really effective and I don’t get antsy or feel like I need to jump out of my skin. A Japanese study also found it to have anti-inflammatory effects, but the study was published in 1980 and isn’t available online for free.
I have ordered some of this at it ticks a few boxes after my 23andme.com results.
I will post results if there is any interest.
Hederegenin is often times grouped in the stimulant category because it tends to also have vasoconstriction properties (via PFAF) which fail Skondia’s criteria.Several researchers compare it almost directly to Cocaine without the side-effects.
As far as research shows, Bacopa just smells like lemon, and otherwise doesn’t do anything. You’d do better with a basic racetam stack.
Fair enough. Though typically I find comparisons of X to cocaine to be overdone, often alarmist, and not usually helpful. Case in point: http://tinyurl.com/plg54tc
The reason being is cocaine works similarly to a million other drugs; impeding the uptake of neurotransmitters for dopamine, serotonin, and norephinephrine. It’s probably even more similar to caffeine than hederagenin. Cocaine and caffeine also both result in a huge output of epinephrine. In that regard, you could also say hederagenin is like caffeine without the side effects.
Looking at bacopa, it appears to do more than smell like lemon, but it’s just not well studied enough to know exactly what that is. I don’t think I would bother trying it at this point. There was one double-blind placebo-controlled study: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18611150 but it’s by these guys: http://www.ncnm.edu/helfgott-research/about-helfgott.php
Stanley Medical Research Institute was also doing a study on using it for schizophrenia but not sure if it was completed.
But don’t listen to me- I’m a hypocrite. Hederagenin has only had a couple studies itself (which is why I won’t be taking it long term)
Oh? Any links to this research would be useful.
In addition, most OTC versions of Bacopa show high amounts of variation in content (http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23204618).
There’s a stack of very detail lacking research which makes two claims:
- Bacopa is useful in treating Schizophrenia
- Bacopa is useful in elderly patients suffering cognitive decline
I found no study which made a strong claim, or posted any statistical relevance information aside from “scores were better” concerning Bacopa (obviously, my search is non-exhaustive, so, feel free to contradict me).
I tried Soylent for a month, and paired it with Noopept. It has been the best Nootropic that I have tried to date, and I would advise it to anyone looking for strong clarity.
Since they removed the nootropics from the official soylent, will we be able to add noopept to that safely when we receive it in august, or will it depend on that recipe?
Actually, Noopept is best taken sublingually. You can mix it in with your Soylent if you wish, and it shouldn’t harm anything, but I recommend sticking it under your tongue and letting it dissolve.
coluracetam is definitely very nice. similar to noopept, but with more of a calm alert feeling. tianeptine is essentially happy powder, much more powerful than any antidepressent with less side effects. kind of scary how well it works. great combo imo.
I found noopept didn’t do a lot for me, and it was so incredibly nasty tasting (powder form) that it was very difficult to hide even a tiny amount in a drink. I made my own capsules instead and that was better. Still, the overall results were if anything, extremely subtle. From my reading noopept seems to be very individual… maybe it ties in with nutrition and so for some it works better than others. Wondering if I should try it again now that I have Soylent (this was a couple years ago that I tried it).
My favorite supplement right now is not technically a nootropic (IMO anyway) though it’s often referred to as such. It’s a simple synergistic combination - caffeine & L-Theanine. I started taking them together and was shocked at their effectiveness. Excellent and lasting energy without any hint of being “wired” until I took 320mg of caffeine all at once. Even then, the only way I really noticed anything to be a little extreme was that my eyes felt like they were bugging a bit.
I’ve now decided that my personal upper limit is 240mg of caffeine (which means 480 mg of theanine since it’s a 1:2 ratio caffeine to theanine). It’s the most cost effective potent lasting energy formula I’ve found - and I’ve tried a LOT of various combinations both with and without caffeine, over about 15 years.
For some reason, this combo is often called a nootropic… maybe it meets the technical definition, I don’t know. But you can buy each component separately very easily, though it’s much MUCH cheaper to buy pre-mixed capsules. I got mine from www.powdercity.com who just so happens to also sell noopept capsules.
TL; DR: Big thumbs up for caffeine with theanine. It seems a bit counter intuitive since theanine is a mild sedative and generally thought of to take at night to help with sleep, but it combines with caffeine to create an amazing “more than the sum of its parts” effect.
Here’s another vote for caffeine/theanine! It’s the first nootropic I’ve tried and I do not take any other medications/supplements beyond soylent, but the benefit was immediately noticeable (taking a pill of 100mg caffeine/ 200mg theanine). Energy, focus, feeling motivated/clear headed, but no jitters. I’ve only been taking it for a week and only one dose a day in the mornings, but I will start testing a second dose in the afternoon or just a higher dose and see how I respond. I plan to get them in powder form to help with this (and yes, I’m aware of the dangers of caffeine dosage).
I’m really interested in adding some combination of Noopept, piracetam, alpha-gpc, Ashwagandha, and a few others… but I’m having some trouble finding reliable sources on what nootropic stacks are not only effective, but also as safe as possible taking into account the various interactions. I’m only interested in what’s scientifically backed and proven reasonably “safe” from widespread, long-term use. I’ll leave the true exploring to people more adventurous than I!
I know I’m wading into some uncharted territory here, but after feeling the boost of just the caffeine/theanine, I’m extremely curious what else is out there (and safe for long term use). I would love to boost my focus, motivation, and memory as much as I am able.
Yeah the tricky thing about nootropics is that for the most part they haven’t really been studied much. A few have, but usually not in combination with others. Mostly all you can find are anecdotal discussions in forums, which is a lot better than nothing but ultimately you just have to be your own guinea pig. These days I’m very happy with simply the caffeine/theanine combo. Usually I just take 160:320mg in the morning, but sometimes I do 80:160mg twice a day, and other times 160:320mg twice a day. I try to watch out for caffeine tolerance buildup though so I usually skip it at least 1 or 2 days a week.
It’s just such a simple combination to obtain and take (especially with them being in a single capsule now)… the convenience factor goes perfectly with Soylent.
When i was in boarding school, they used to serve both tea and coffee. I used to mix them both and consume. I dont remember its effectiveness compared to consuming tea or coffee alone. But it served as a wonderful pick me up. Is theanine present in tea as they sound similar?
Edit…i looked it up it, is found in tea and so is caffeine too but probably in low doses as compared to those pills.
When i started tea/coffee…one or rarely two cups would be enough for me, but i kept on consuming more and now i ended up needing three to four cups for the same effect. So there is a possibility one could develop increased tolerance to it.
Yep, this is why (well, one reason) I go a day or two without every week. Sometimes more actually if I just don’t have anything going on where I need the added “pep”.